Episode 643 (Duration 31:51) Illinois attorney Gary True explains the risk involved for anyone who reveals their gun in public.

Licensed and unlicensed gun carriers have something to worry about.

APPLE PODCASTS GOOGLE PODCASTS

SPOTIFY ANDROID RSS

DIRECT DOWNLOAD

In This Episode…

“A law abiding person that exposes his gun too much, what ever too much is, is subject to being charged and subject to being searched .” — Gary True.

Attorney Gary True

Gary True practices in the areas of business and corporate law, mergers and acquisitions and estate planning.  He also concentrates in the area of self-defense and firearms law. 

Gary is licensed to practice law in Illinois, Missouri and Wisconsin. He also teaches a course for other Illinois conceal carry instructors.

Contact Information 

Gary True
515 St. Louis Street, Suite 203
Edwardsville, Illinois 62025

Tel: 314.872.0331
Fax: 314.872.0321
[email protected]

“Can’t Miss” Moments:

✓ What does the Illinois Concealed Carry law say about exposing your gun in public? What every properly licensed gun carrier has to be worried about. (Go to 3:58)

✓ This two-word adjective has become a term of art for lawyers and gun owners. Funny how the term is not defined anywhere in the code, and reasonable minds can invent their own working definitions. This is the term we are all waiting for the court to define. (Go to 5:12)

✓ Like it or not, properly licensed gun carriers can still get arrested for carrying a gun if this happens. Here’s a clear example of how not to carry your gun in public…when just a few seconds can get you arrested. (Go to 5:49) & (9:42)

✓ A certain group of gun instructors believe this legal term means something else entirely different than what some Illinois judges say it means. The consequences may be dire for certain people if we don’t all get on the same page. (Go to 7:15)

✓ The absurdity of it…Guy walking down the street and a gust of wind blows his jacket open a bit exposing the butt of his gun. Some say a crime has just been committed.  (Go to 8:25) & (10:00)

✓ This “ordinary common sense” standard is dead. Why the old rules before the current laws existed don’t help us, and in fact, might hurt us. (Go to 8:39)

✓ The real reason you’re likely to get arrested if you are seen with a gun in public.  (Go to 10:00)

✓ WARNING – All gun owners licensed to conceal carry better make sure they understand the “traffic stop” rule. If the officer says these magic words a gun carrier has to respond in the right way or risk getting arrested for providing the wrong answer. (Go to 11:55)

✓ What is NOT in the statute is as important as what is in the statute. Knowing what’s not in there can save you some hassle. There are a lot of unanswered questions about the law, but Gary says there are some clear-cut examples of when an officer cannot stop you even when they know for sure you have a gun.  (Go to 13:16)

✓ 3 serious hints are out there, if you know where to look, strongly suggesting what the court is going to do next. (Go to 18:30)

✓ How a federal case can come along and upend and change the rules in Illinois. If it’s going to happen it will happen this way. (Go to 21:05)

✓ Holding your crotch is not indicative of gun possession precisely because police see no gun. That being said, once you take this out of your pants all bets are off…and if it’s fully out then you really have some problems. (Go to 24:01)

✓ Let’s face it, most law abiding conceal carry citizens are not going to have trouble with the police. This is the number one thing they have to worry about. (Go to 25:40)

✓ Keep an eye on the case law and look for answers to these questions: (1) What in the world does “mostly concealed” mean? (2) Will the Thomas dicta hold-up? (3) Exactly what other factors can be used to justify a gun search? (Go to 28:40)

Links & Resources

• People v. Thomas, 2019 IL App (1st) 170474 (March): (in dicta court suggests seeing a gun otherwise properly concealed does not establish probable cause or reasonable suspicion)
• Illinois Search & Seizure Resource Page
• Illinois Conceal Carry Law
• Illinois FOID Law
• Andrew Branca Law of Self Defense
• People v. Norals, 2019 IL App (1st) 173010-U (Rule 23 case, police see the outline of a gun through this skinny jeans)
• People v. Harris, 2018 IL App (1st) 151142-U (February) (Rule 23 case, very anoymous tip of person with a gun cannot be used to justify this stop and search)
• People v. Holmes, 2017 IL 120407 (July) (good faith exception says a stop and a search before the change in the law does not mean evidence has to be suppressed)

Here’s That Dicta From Thomas

People v. Thomas, 2019 IL App (1st) 170474 (March):

“We wish to emphasize that under the current legal landscape, police cannot simply assume a person who possesses a firearm outside the home is involved in criminal activity. Likewise, they cannot use a firearm in partial view, such as a semi-exposed gun protruding from the pant pocket of a person on a public street, alone as probable cause to arrest an individual for illegal possession without first identifying whether the individual has the necessary licenses.”

See Also

You may also want to check out…

• Episode 609 – People v. Thomas, 2019 IL App (1st) 170474 (March) (Police see a man hand a gun to another man in dicta court states seeing a gun alone does not create basis for a stop.)
• Episode  387 – People v. Holmes, 2017 IL 120407 (July) (Before The Conceal & Carry Became Law Police Could Stop You If They Saw A Gun)
• Episode 601 – People v. Holmes, 2019 IL App (1st) 160987 (March)(police get a tip of man with a gun problem was the tip was completely anonymous)
• Episode 447 – In re Jarrell C., 2017 IL App (1st) 170932 (December) (holding your crotch is not indicative of carrying a gun)